Burn with no errors, but verify fails - disc is blank

[BobN]

I'm using a Dell Vostro 1000 (I will NEVER buy another computer from Dell - many, many hardware problems with this system - for instance, the keyboard has been replaced five times) running XP PRO SP3.

 

A burn will complete with no errors but the verify will fail ("Layouts do not match").

 

After closing the msgbox with the error message, IMGBURN shows the disc as empty. Windows also thinks it is blank (it will pop up the 'what do you want to do with this type disk' window and show the disc as blank.) Roxio Creator DE Version: 9.1.573 SP1 also shows that the disc is empty as does DVD Decrypter which I use to copy TV shows I record on DVD-RWs, using a standalone DVD recorder, to HDD and then later, after some editing, to write them to DVD+R. I only started using IMGBURN last month.

 

This error also occurs when I try to burn discs with Roxio, DVD Decrypter, and XP's built-in CD burning facility - that is, I enable recording for the drive, drag and drop files to the drive, tell windows to write them and then the disk is blank after the burn.

 

The drive's "Enable CD recording on this drive" property is normally off - I only set it on to test the drag and drop XP burning facility to see if this problem occured with it, which it did.

 

When using Roxio, the burn completes with no errors and then the "verify" completes instantly with no errors - but the disc is blank.

 

If I compare the surface of a "failed" disc to a new disc, the surface looks the same - you can generally see written sections of a disc. I really believe that nothing has been written to the disc when this error occurs.

 

This problem began about 6 months ago and DVD/CD drive has been replaced by Dell but that did not fix the problem. It started as an occasional intermittent problem and now has grown to almost a constant problem. Of 7 discs I tried to burn this evening, only one was successful.

 

The problem occurs when I try to burn DVD images to DVDs with DVD Decrypter and IMGBURN, when I try to write files to a DVD or CD using Roxio, and when I try to write CD image files using DVD Decrypter and IMGBURN.

 

I have tried several different brands of media and I have tried several write speeds, from 4X to MAX and the problem still occurs.

 

The latest firmware is installed for the drive.

 

One note - for about the first 2 years that we had this system, this problem never occurred - sure a burn might fail occasionally due to some type of problem with the disc, itself, but we burned A LOT of CDs and DVDs without encountering this strange problem.

 

I do not remember if this problem started soon after I installed XP SP3 but it is a possibility. I would uninstall SP3 but, for whatever reason, it is not listed in the Add/Remove list and the hidden uninstall directory does not exist. Hmmmm - perhaps reinstall SP3??? I don't want to do something this drastic without knowing that it can be done without first uninstalling the first installation of SP3 which, as I said, gave me no method to uninstall it. Just some thoughts....

 

Here is the log file from the last failure -

 

I 21:26:18 ImgBurn Version 2.5.2.0 started!
I 21:26:18 Microsoft Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600 : Service Pack 3)
I 21:26:18 Total Physical Memory: 915,432 KB  -  Available: 121,272 KB
I 21:26:18 Initialising SPTI...
I 21:26:18 Searching for SCSI / ATAPI devices...
I 21:26:19 -> Drive 1 - Info: TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D DE04 (D:) (ATA)
I 21:26:19 Found 1 DVD±RW!
I 21:26:30 Operation Started!
I 21:26:30 Source File: C:\isos\7-3 7-5.iso
I 21:26:30 Source File Sectors: 356,260 (MODE1/2048)
I 21:26:30 Source File Size: 729,620,480 bytes
I 21:26:30 Source File Volume Identifier: 101216_2104
I 21:26:30 Source File File System(s): ISO9660, Joliet
I 21:26:30 Destination Device: [3:0:0] TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D DE04 (D:) (ATA)
I 21:26:30 Destination Media Type: CD-R (Disc ID: 97m26s66f, CMC Magnetics Corp.) (Speeds: 4x, 10x, 16x, 20x, 24x)
I 21:26:30 Destination Media Sectors: 359,844
I 21:26:30 Write Mode: CD
I 21:26:30 Write Type: SAO
I 21:26:30 Write Speed: MAX
I 21:26:30 Lock Volume: Yes
I 21:26:30 Test Mode: No
I 21:26:30 OPC: No
I 21:26:30 BURN-Proof: Enabled
I 21:26:30 Write Speed Successfully Set! - Effective: 4,234 KB/s (24x)
I 21:26:31 Filling Buffer... (20 MB)
I 21:26:31 Writing LeadIn...
I 21:27:03 Writing Session 1 of 1... (1 Track, LBA: 0 - 356259)
I 21:27:03 Writing Track 1 of 1... (MODE1/2048, LBA: 0 - 356259)
I 21:31:23 Synchronising Cache...
I 21:31:48 Exporting Graph Data...
I 21:31:48 Graph Data File: C:\Documents and Settings\Sharon\Application Data\ImgBurn\Graph Data Files\TSSTcorp_DVD+-RW_TS-L632D_DE04_THURSDAY-DECEMBER-16-2010_9-26_PM_97m26s66f_MAX.ibg
I 21:31:48 Export Successfully Completed!
I 21:31:48 Operation Successfully Completed! - Duration: 00:05:18
I 21:31:48 Average Write Rate: 2,751 KB/s (18.3x) - Maximum Write Rate: 3,666 KB/s (24.4x)
E 21:31:48 Verify Failed! - Reason: Layouts do not match.

 

Here is information IMGBURN shows for the disc after the failed burn -

 

TSSTcorp DVD+-RW TS-L632D DE04 (ATA)
Current Profile: CD-R

Disc Information:
Status: Empty
State of Last Session: Empty
Erasable: No
Free Sectors: 359,844
Free Space: 736,960,512 bytes
Free Time: 79:59:69 (MM:SS:FF)
Next Writable Address: 0
Supported Write Speeds: 4x, 10x, 16x, 20x, 24x

ATIP Information:
Disc ID: 97m26s66f
Manufacturer: CMC Magnetics Corp.
Start Time of LeadIn: 97m26s66f
Last Possible Start Time of LeadOut: 79m59s71f

Performance (Write Speed):
Descriptor 1...
-> B0: 0x00, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 704 KB/s (4x)
Descriptor 2...
-> B0: 0x00, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 704 KB/s (4x)
Descriptor 3...
-> B0: 0x00, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 1,760 KB/s (10x)
Descriptor 4...
-> B0: 0x08, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 2,816 KB/s (16x)
Descriptor 5...
-> B0: 0x08, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 3,520 KB/s (20x)
Descriptor 6...
-> B0: 0x08, B1: 0x00, B2: 0x00, B3: 0x00
-> EL: 359834 (0x00057D9A)
-> RS: 4,224 KB/s (24x) - WS: 4,224 KB/s (24x)

 

As you can see, IMGBURN says the disc is empty.

 

Any suggestions?

 

Bob

Edited December 17, 2010 by BobN

[BobN]

Looks like this question stumped everyone - no one even offered a suggestion as to the cause of or solution to the problem.

 

Well, I let it sit on the back burner for a while and I perhaps have figured it out.

 

I've never used the "test" mode when burning a disc but it occurred to me that perhaps what it does is tell the burner to do everything but activate the laser to actually write on the disc. I checked around and that is exactly what happens.

 

So - what if the burner was somehow stuck in "test" mode? That is, what if every time any program wrote to the burner, nothing was actually written because the burner information said it was in "test" mode? I have been unable to burn any discs with any of the software I have - Imgburn, Roxio, DVD DDecrypter, or even XP "drag to disk" burning. Every time the burn completes without any error messages but there is nothing on the disc - CD or DVD. That is exactly what you expect to happen when you burn in "test" mode.

 

So - I ran a "burn" with Imgburn using test mode and then ran the same burn again without test mode. The burn completed but the verify stage never began. The burner drive light just kept blinking after Imgburn said it was beginning to verify the file but nothing on the screen changed and it just sat there.

 

I ejected the disc - had to shutdown windows and restart to do so, the drive was "stuck" in use and would not eject - and then tried burning something with another program - DVD Decrypter - and it worked.

 

I don't know why the verify stage of the actual burn - after the "test" burn - using Imgburn failed, there is data on the disk, but I really don't care since I was dealing with a rather bizarre problem anyway and one can expect additional bizarre behavior as one works on such a problem. It would probably have been impossible, and still is, to determine just what happened there but, provided the problem is gone, I really don't care what happened.

 

I've now burned 4 discs - 2 DVD Decrypter and 2 with Roxio - without problems and will continue with several others that I need to burn - up until now all attempts to burn discs were failing and this has been going on since I posted the original message on 16 December 2010.

I will report back as to the long term results.

 

It looks like the burner was perhaps stuck in test mode but only time, and additional burns, will tell for sure.

 

Bob

[Cynthia]

Here's my 1 cent.

 

I've never used the "test" mode when burning a disc but it occurred to me that perhaps what it does is tell the burner to do everything but activate the laser to actually write on the disc. I checked around and that is exactly what happens.

True. But that it should be stuck in test mode, I've never heard of.

 

I've had burners that could burn, but could never initiate/read the burned disc. It could be read by other burners/readers. Indicating a dying burner.

 

Have you tried with some higher quality media?

 

E 21:31:48 Verify Failed! - Reason: Layouts do not match.

Usually happens with low quality media.

 

What media code/brand have you used when you burned DVDs?

 

DVD Decrypters verify mode is a bit different than ImgBurn. DVDD only checks that the disc can be read. It's not comparing the burned data to the source data.

[BobN]

Here's my 1 cent.

 

I've never used the "test" mode when burning a disc but it occurred to me that perhaps what it does is tell the burner to do everything but activate the laser to actually write on the disc. I checked around and that is exactly what happens.

True. But that it should be stuck in test mode, I've never heard of.

 

I've had burners that could burn, but could never initiate/read the burned disc. It could be read by other burners/readers. Indicating a dying burner.

 

Have you tried with some higher quality media?

 

E 21:31:48 Verify Failed! - Reason: Layouts do not match.

Usually happens with low quality media.

 

What media code/brand have you used when you burned DVDs?

 

DVD Decrypters verify mode is a bit different than ImgBurn. DVDD only checks that the disc can be read. It's not comparing the burned data to the source data.

 

By the way, I've been in Data Processing for 37+ years.

 

The system in question is about 3 years old and up until early fall of last year it had produced thousands of CDs and DVDs without only the occasional read or write errors - which are to be expected given the nature of the media.

 

Yes, thousands - I do a lot of software development and I backup work several times a day. I have learned, the hard way, to never trust a computer's disk drives, for very long, with anything that you can't easily reproduce and I am thus a "suspenders and belt guy" when it comes to data security - I make more than one type of back up - discs and maybe tape or external disk drive or USB memory sticks.

 

I also record a lot of PBS programs of the air on to DVD+RWs using a DVD recorder. I then clean them up a bit and write them out to DVD+R. I record at least 20 shows a week and sometimes more. I often make copies of the PBS discs for my 92 year old father. I also have some DVDs that I've shot and have made lots of copies of them for other people. So, yes, that drive had written thousands of discs before this problem began.

 

Then verifies began failing pretty consistently. Imgburn would say the layouts were not the same and other software reported seek and read checks and other errors - it was dependent upon how a particular programmer had decided to word an error message.

 

I checked one of the discs and found it to be empty - several programs reported it as empty/blank -- Imgburn, DVD Decrypter, Roxio, Nero, etc. The discs were absolutely empty - they were in virgin condition, nothing had been written to them.

 

I tried at least 5 different programs and with all of them the burn would finish without errors and the verify would fail because the discs were empty - it's hard to compare nothing to something.

 

I tried at least 7 brands of discs and the problem continued. Dell replaced the drive but the problem reappeared in a few days. Dell then said I'd have to reinstall windows - right!

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------

User -- "My sink is stopped up, what should I do?"

Support Tech - "Tear down the house and rebuild it."

-------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I had given up on producing discs on that system and began using a different system for that purpose. I used some USB memory sticks to move things to the other system.

 

I've learned that you often need to simply put a seemingly unsolvable problem on your mental back burner and let it simmer for a while.

 

This morning, I got to thinking about this problem and the word "test" was mentally flashing at me.

 

I thought about it for a second and realized I was not really sure what "test" mode did or did not do. I did a Google on it (lots and lots of hits) and found that it means that the drive does everything but actually energize the laser.

 

The result is that the software does not receive any error codes (provided the drive is able to handle the data flow speed and such) and the disc is still empty after the "burn."

 

I instantly thought "what if the drive is stuck in test mode"

 

Okay, I don't know where the test mode flag is kept, whether it is kept in the burner's memory or in a windows table. If the flag is set in the burner's memory then it would likely persist across restarts. If the flag is only in RAM, then it would not persist across restarts - but it was worth a try.

 

As I described in my reply, above, I am now able to burn discs on that system. I've burn about 9 DVDs this evening without any problems - the verifies were successful.

 

Just now I did another burn and it failed in the verify but the data is on the disc so it is a "valid" verify error, that is, there was a problem with a write or a read or the disc has a defect.

 

I am using the same brand of DVDs (Philips DVD+R) tonight that I have been using for perhaps more than a year. I was using them when the problem started so I'm pretty sure we are dealing with a disc quality problem.

 

I understand disc comparability problems. We have a DVD Recorder on which I record a lot of PBS programs, of the air. I've found that only Sony DVD+RW discs will work in the unit. Memorex, Philips, and some others I've tried won't work - the unit reports a recording problem and drops out of record mode.

 

But with this burn problem on that other computer, I'm sure it was not a disc compatibility or quality issue.

 

As to the verify method - perhaps DVD Decrypter is different than Imgbburn (could the author perhaps tell us whether that is true?), but the verifies done by Roxio, Nero, etc. are, from what I read, byte for byte comparisons.

 

If a "verify" option in any type of "copy" or "transfer" software does not actually compare the copy to the original, it goes against all standards for verifying the validity of data copies/output.

 

Now, there is another method that is sometimes used but it is not as accurate as an actual comparison of the data. That is to calculate a checksum (of whatever sort you want, CRC32, SHA, etc) of the original file and the copy. If the checksums are the same, the confidence in the output is quite high.

 

I've written backup programs on mainframes and my verify was always an actual comparison, byte for byte, of the original data to the output.

 

Checksums offer a high degree of certainly, but only an actual comparison gives you total confidence in the output.

 

Given what I've seen tonight, I'm convinced that, in one way or another, the drive was stuck in test mode. When software wrote to the device, it did not actually write any data and it did not return any error codes and thus the software thought the writes were successful.

 

If you look at Mark's topic (http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=16895), you'll see that his burner and mine are both TSSTcorp devices on Dell systems - perhaps TSSTcorp has issues, I don't know.

 

But I do know that I've burned more discs tonight than I've been able to burn in months on that system. As of about 2 months ago, every burn failed, in that the discs were empty after the burn.

 

I may be wrong, perhaps what I'm seeing is simply the ghost in the machine toying with me, but, as I've said, burns are working properly now.

 

Hopefully this will permanently resolve the problem but, of course, that remains to be seen.

 

I appreciate your replies, on this topic and my other one, thanks.

 

Bob

[LIGHTNING UK!]

DVD Decrypter just used to check the sectors on the burnt disc were physically readable.

 

ImgBurn does a byte for byte comparison.