Can ImgBurn help detect bootleg DVD's?

[0717]

Hi guys

 

Sorry in advance if this kind of question has been answered before - I couldn't find any info regarding this issue.  

 

I recently purchased two DVD sets of a Japanese show from a seller on eCrater, and the quality is, well...awful.  I've been trying to find out if these DVD's are in fact bootleg copies, and I decided to see if I could use this type of software to detect anything that seems off.  The seller had stellar reviews, the DVD cases are thoroughly convincing (as are the discs), but the title menu and episodes are so degraded that I find it difficult to believe that these are authentic copies.

 

I believe the DVD's are from Malaysia.  One thing that instantly stands out to me is the fact that they are single layer discs.  I contacted the seller regarding this, and they responded with:

 

"The product is authentic. Manufacture using single layer DVDs do not means they are not genuine. You can find exactly same products sell in amazon.com and the price is much higher.

 

May be you do not often purchase Asia DVDs. Asia DVDs usually using single layer DVDs and compress the video. Also you should not watch Asia DVD by PS3, computer or other game machine. They usually only can be watch by regular DVD players.

 

We understand if you watch by very big TV, the video quality may not looks very good. However most our customers who watch by TVs which up to 42 inches do not report any problem."

 

 

So I wanted to know if I could find any further info on the discs by opening it up in ImgBurn (please note that I am not familiar with this kind of software or anything to do with burning discs).  I did notice it say "Imp ID: AHEAD Nero" and I am aware that Nero is another disc burning software.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

 

[Peru]

 

"The product is authentic. Manufacture using single layer DVDs do not means they are not genuine. You can find exactly same products sell in amazon.com and the price is much higher.

 

May be you do not often purchase Asia DVDs. Asia DVDs usually using single layer DVDs and compress the video. Also you should not watch Asia DVD by PS3, computer or other game machine. They usually only can be watch by regular DVD players.

 

We understand if you watch by very big TV, the video quality may not looks very good. However most our customers who watch by TVs which up to 42 inches do not report any problem."

 

 

 

 

The poor grammar is a sure indication. 

Edited September 13, 2014 by Peru

[0717]

Haha, I think so, too.  

 

Hoping to have some "solid" proof in order to dispute this through Paypal.  Any idea about the Imp ID?  What is it?  Does it track the software used to burn discs?

 

[dbminter]

Probably a good way to tell if they're not bootlegs is a physical examination of the DVD.  Look on the bottom data layer.  Is there a bar code(s) or serial number(s) on the inner ring?  If there are, this is a good indication that the discs are pressed DVD's.  Pressed DVD's are made in manufacturing plants and not burned by DVD burners.

 

 

Another good way to check is to put a disc in a DVD drive, open ImgBurn in Read mode, and check the right pane of information.  If Current Profile says DVD-R/DVD+R or some kind of recordable DVD or something other than DVD-ROM, it was burned on a DVD burner.  Also look for an MID entry.  If there's a MID, it's a recordable DVD and not pressed.

 

 

However, just because it's a recordable DVD doesn't necessarily mean it's a bootleg.  Amazon.com sells some manufactured on demand DVD's.  These are recordable DVD's.  I have a few of them.  So, they aren't bootlegs as the company that licensed the material authorized their creation to recordable DVD.

 

 

Mind if I ask the name of this show you got?  If there's an entry on Amazon.com that doesn't say on demand, then it's a pressed DVD release.

 

 

Unfortunately, anime (If it's an anime.  You just said it was a Japanese show.) gets bootlegged all the time.  I had to get Samurai Pizza Cats direct from the manufacturer because sellers on Amazon.com weren't necessarily selling the official, pressed DVD release.  Some were selling bootlegs.  They were fairly convincing bootlegs with authentic looking box art and disc labels.  What gave them away was the video quality.  The pressed DVD's were DVD-9's.  The bootlegs were DVD-5's.

[0717]

Thanks for the response, dbminter.

 

The DVD sets I got was Hotaru no Hikari season 1 and 2, a Japanese drama series based off of a manga of the same name.

 

Just ran ImgBurn in read mode and this is what I get:

 

TSSTcorp CDDVDW TS-L633C TF02 (SATA)

Current Profile: DVD-ROM

 

Disc Information:

Status: Complete

State of Last Session: Complete

Erasable: No

Sessions: 1

Sectors: 1,484,944

Size: 3,041,165,312 bytes

Time: 330:01:19 (MM:SS:FF)

Supported Read Speeds: 2x, 4x, 6x, 8x

Current Read Speed: 3.3x - 8x

 

File System Information:

Sectors: 1,484,688

Size: 3,040,641,024 bytes

Time: 329:57:63 (MM:SS:FF)

 

TOC Information:

Session 1... (LBA: 0)

-> Track 01  (Mode 1, LBA: 0 - 1484943)

-> LeadOut  (LBA: 1484944)

 

Track Information:

Session 1...

-> Track 01 (LTSA: 0, LTS: 1484944, LRA: 0)

 

Physical Format Information (Last Recorded):

Book Type: DVD-ROM

Part Version: 1

Disc Size: 120 mm

Maximum Read Rate: 10.08 Mbps

Number of Layers: 1

Track Path: Parallel Track Path (PTP)

Linear Density: 0.267 um/bit

Track Density: 0.74 um/track

First Physical Sector of Data Area: 196,608

Last Physical Sector of Data Area: 1,681,551

Last Physical Sector in Layer 0: 0

 

I don't see any MID, and it indicates that the disc is a DVD-ROM.  I just find a hard time believing this is a legitimate disc purely based on the quality.  I do see numbers on the underside of the disc.  The most inner ring reads "IFPI NU67" then on the second inner ring it reads both "IFPI LN58" and "JPN 0693D-DISC 1".  Sounds like it should be legit, right?

 

 

I've attached a screenshot of how the menu looks when run on my computer (no different to the PS3).  It also constantly has that 'DVD VERSION' logo at the top corner of the screen as the episode plays, as well as on the cases - no film/TV studio logo to be found anywhere.

 

I mean, do they really compress movies/series onto single layer discs that shouldn't be run on PS3 or computers in Asia?  I do have a DVD player but I haven't bothered to try playing the DVD's on it seeing as I find that a little hard to believe...  Plus, my computer is formatted to play region 2 DVD's (British) and it still runs on here, suggesting that there is no region restrictions on the DVD.  Is this also a red flag?

 

Edited September 13, 2014 by 0717

[dbminter]

Yeah, it's hard to say.  The serial numbers just mean the discs were pressed in a factory instead of burned on a PC.  The contents on the discs could still be bootleg and not authorized by the content owner.  The bootleggers could have used DVD-5's to reduce costs.

 

 

There are cases where companies compress DVD-9 contents to DVD-5.  The original release of the Definitive Edition of all 5 seasons of the Twilight Zone were DVD-9's.  Image then released a second pressing where they compressed the DVD-9's contents to DVD-5's.  The disc contents were the same, even down to the same missing extras and some options crashing Windows Media Player.

 

 

The DVD Version logo is slightly suspicious.

 

 

I mean, I guess there could be cases where the contents are bootlegged but pressed to DVD's instead of recordable DVD's.  The contents could still be bootleg.  Sort of like toys from the 1980's like Transformers.  There were bootlegs of the toys that were made from copies of the exact same molds as the originals.  They were just using lesser quality plastics.  For instance, around 1985, I managed to save my mother half off on a bootleg Voltron Black Lion.  It was exactly the same mold, just a bootleg.  She didn't believe it would work with my other 4 genuine Matchbox Lions.  But, it did because I knew it was the exact same mold.

[0717]

Thanks again, dbminter - your input is really appreciated.  Not really sure where to go from here in identifying whether it is bootleg or not.  They're insisting that it's original, and that I should return the DVD's for a refund, but I'll be damned if I pay more in postage costs (it was $5 per DVD to ship to me) for something that I seriously suspect is bootleg! 

 

The biggest indicator here is price.  I only paid $20 per set.  As stated in my original post, I believe the discs are from Malaysia.  I simply thought that because they were produced for the Malaysian/Chinese markets that this would mean they were somehow less desirable to the western consumer, and this would be reflected in the price.  The Japanese version is just under $200, and that's only for the first series! 

Edited September 13, 2014 by 0717

[dbminter]

Yeah, if you paid 10 times less for your version, I'd say it's more than likely safe to infer you got a bootleg.  Sorry.

 

 

I just now remembered.  I believe I have bootlegs in my collection that were pressed DVD's instead of DVD-R's.  Before Paramount/Olive released The Colossus Of New York on an official home video DVD, I got a bootleg DVD that contained a TV print.  It was obviously a TV print because it had the AMC (American Movie Classics) logo throughout the film.  I remember seeing the film on AMC in the early 1990's.  I believe that DVD was pressed.

 

 

Before MGM officially released Gog on an on demand from Amazon.com DVD-R, I got what I believe is a pressed bootleg.

 

 

In the United States, Disney's Song Of The South will never be released on DVD.  So, I found a $20 Asian bootleg DVD in a local video rental store.  It was a nice quality print and even had extras.  What definitely makes it a bootleg is one of the video streams that you can't actually play on your DVD player (You have to access it with PC conversions software.) is a Warner Brothers cartoon.  A cartoon short from a rival studio would never appear on an official DVD Disney release.  I believe that DVD was also pressed.

[0717]

Funny thing is, if it was decent quality, then I wouldn't be that upset about it... lol

[0717]

Sorry to keep this thread alive, I was wondering if someone could kindly clarify the Imp ID thing for me?

[LIGHTNING UK!]

That field gets filled out by the software that built the file system used on the disc (or in the image). It doesn't change when burnt.

[0717]

Perfect - that's what I imagined it was.  I think that pretty much confirms my suspicions.  Thanks!