fast forwarding to layer break to test it

[lpew]

Is there some way of determining where the layer break is when viewing a dvd? I want to test the dvd to make sure it plays through the break ok, but I can't figure out how to get to the break.

 

If I first open the disk with imgburn, it shows me where the break is in terms of sectors and %. But as far as I can tell, zoom player only displays time (elapsed and left) on the slide bar. I guess I would like to view sectors (I'm not quite sure what a sector is exactly, so if it turns out that wanting to view sectors during playback is a really stupid concept, then you're welcome for the good laugh!). And % doesn't seem to work, because I gather it's not a % of the film, but a % of the entire contents of the dvd including extras, etc.

 

So... anyone have a trick?

 

<edited a typo>

Edited November 12, 2005 by lpew

[Grain]

Good question, one I don't have the answer too. I'd check it on a standalone player instead of your computer, if you verify after burning you'll know whether your comp. can read it or not. If you have a standalone player that doesn't have a buffer, you'll almost always notice a slight stutter at the layer break, even on pressed discs. Buffered players will prevent the stutter, so "finding" the LB on one of them is hard/impossible. If someone knows a way to find the LB in terms of actual time elapsed/remaining, that would obviously be easiest.

[Kenadjian]

I have never done this, but if you take note of the time and sector that Imgburn is about to aproach the LB, then keep an eye on the time on your player then that should be where the LB is.

[dbminter]

About the best way I can think of is to load the IFO files in IFOEdit and look for the Layer Break entry. Then, preview it and load that segment of the DVD in a DVD player standalone and see if there's the tell tale pause. Since the LB will most likely be within the movie itself, you can start right off with the movie's IFO file. Of course, the more IFO files there are, the longer it will take, so, it can be a very quick, or a very long, method.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

load the image in imgburn, right click the value next to 'Sectors:' in the Source box.

 

There's only 1 option on the context menu so it shouldn't be hard to figure out which one you need to click

[lpew]

Thanks to everyone's suggestions. Especially Lightning UK! That is exactly what I was looking for.

 

(Oh, those hidden little gems. And here I thought I had right-clicked on everything.)

[rcubed]

Ipew,

On my Sony standalone there is a menu option that allows an on screen display of the dynamic bit rate and the layer that is currently playing. It's a picture of the disk with a pointer and number indicating the layer and position (approximately) where the player is playing. I just pop the disk in, select that option and by using the scene selection zero in on the layer break. Don't know how may other player have that option.

 

r*3

[lpew]

r*3,

 

Thanks for the heads-up. I'll check my player.

[dbminter]

load the image in imgburn, right click the value next to 'Sectors:' in the Source box.

 

There's only 1 option on the context menu so it shouldn't be hard to figure out which one you need to click

 

 

LUK, do you have a suggestion on what to use if you have a multi-part split image? Use my IFOEdit idea or got something easier?

[dbminter]

I have never done this, but if you take note of the time and sector that Imgburn is about to aproach the LB, then keep an eye on the time on your player then that should be where the LB is.

 

 

I tried something like this just now. It works, but, may not for a particular situation. For instance, with a split image set, you'd have to mount the image to a virtual drive first. If it's not split, then, use LUK's suggestion. Then, note the start time listed. Then, open a DVD player and load the contents of the disc in whatever way into the play and go to that time location and see if the contents match.

 

 

For split images, there's an extra step. But, you won't be able to do that yet until the next version comes out.

[blutach]

The LB dialogue shows you the VCID of the layer break. Note this and have a look in the IFOs (PgcEdit is easiest) and note the time. Use the next chapter button to go there and then fast rewind and fast forward to view your LB. If you have seamless LB selected, you may not even notice it.

 

Regards

[dbminter]

I was wondering about the seamless layer break option in ImgBurn. Are there any negative aspects to using a seamless layer break? Will some players not play a DL disc properly if it's not present?

[blutach]

They might is the answer db and I know that is as vague an answer as "I don't really know". You really need to experiment with one and see.

 

I can tell you ALL my SONY players play them no trouble (and SONY is known for being picky about specs) as does my high end NAD.

 

A SLB disk should play in any PC drive of course.

 

As a note - SLB is off spec; the audio buffers run out at the layer break. The verifier programs will compain about a SLB. Some authoring progs even force a non-seamless LB flag by putting in a fake cell command at the LB (sometimes you see this bizarre NOP cell commmand there - it is there to force a non-seamless joint as a joint with a cell command can not be seamless). However, this does not mean that in the practical world, SLB does not work. And to have no pause at the LB is so much better.

 

Regards

[dbminter]

I know Sony's PS2 is the slowest layer changer I've ever seen. The pause is clearly visible and audible on them.

[blutach]

Give it a burl mate. My son has a PS2 and I think SLB works on that.

 

Regards

[dbminter]

Give it a burl? As in Ives?

[Movie Junkie]

Give it a burl? As in Ives?

Ives? As in St. Ives?

[dbminter]

No, as in Burl Ives.

[blutach]

Burl - Aussie colloquialism for try. But, yes, as in Ives but not in Milton.

 

And here for those who are not Shamus, Ken, zacoz or anyone else from TLDU - http://www.dunway.com/html/aussie_slang.html

 

Regards

[dbminter]

Okay...

 

 

[Kenadjian]

as in Burl Ives

 

Now, there is a blast from the past.

[dbminter]

Have a holly, jolly Christmas! It's the best time of the year!

 

 

He was also a pretty good actor, too, and the inspiration for Ren And Stimpy's Stinky Wizzleteats. (All the spoken lines between verses of Happy, Happy! Joy, Joy! are either lines from Burl Ives songs or from the movie The Big Country that Ives was in, with Gregory Peck and Chuck Connors.)

[dbminter]

Question about seamless layer breaks. How exactly do they work?

 

 

The layer break has to be present in there, I'm guessing for it to work. That if you IFOEdit the IFO, you'll still find the layer break listed in there. But, how does the player simply not pause at it like before?

[blutach]

Well, really this is a question about how the non-seamless flag works - it's really the reverse.

 

Most, if not all, cell joints are muxed seamlessly - you can't tell there is a cell change if played straight through. This is true also of the cell at the LB. When the cell is marked non-seamless, the player is essentially told to run out the buffers and wait for fresh data. This causes the crappy pause at the LB - and even causes a pause in a single layer DVD if the cell is marked non-seamless.

 

Now, some cells MUST be non-seamless - one example is if a cell command is present, or a cell has still time or is restricted. Another is where the actual sectors being read are non-continguous. But if the sector at the LB is totally contiguous with the previous sector read, generally, you can make the cell seamless, even at the LB.

 

Marking LB cells as non-seamless was a convenient way to allow the player's laser to re-focus on layer 1 and pick up the next bit of data. However, buffers are large enough and modern players are quick enough to get by this, so many players do not need the non-seamless flag to be set.

 

Hope this explains a bit.

 

Regards

[dbminter]

I'm just glad I've found someone who can explain it to me. I know so little about DVD's, it all seems so confusing, and too many places don't want you asking because it's easier to just shut about talking of the internal workings of a DVD than it is to filter out those asking for copying reasons versus someone who wants some knowledge.