Add Support for .CISO file?

Neillithan · February 16, 2009

Hi, I recently found a new program called Pismo File Mount and one of its key features is the .CISO format. It's basically a compressed ISO which uses LZMA compression. It lets you mount the CISO in its own program so that's good, but I need a program that will let me burn .CISO files easily. Since Pismo is free and open source, I figured IMGBurn would be the ideal candidate to make this feature suggestion.

Can you add burning or creation support for CISO files? If you're not sure what a .CISO file is, you can find out more by visiting www.pismotechnic.com It will tell you everything you need to know about it.

Thanks,

-Neil

Edited February 16, 2009 by Neillithan

**blutach** · February 16, 2009

Why not just expand the CISO to a regular ISO and burn?

Regards

Neillithan · February 16, 2009

Why not just expand the CISO to a regular ISO and burn?

Regards

Well, because that works but it would be nice if CISO was supported as an input or output format for ImgBurn. There's always the hard way, which is why we call upon an easier way. Can it be done?

Thanks,

-Neil

Edited February 16, 2009 by Neillithan

**mmalves** · February 16, 2009

Another compressed ISO format? I don't think :worthy: The Boss has changed his mind on this subject :unsure:

Neillithan · February 16, 2009

Another compressed ISO format? I don't think The Boss has changed his mind on this subject

Bummer. I wish people were more open to advances like this. CISO is free, open source and all free image programs should be complemented with it. They support ISO because it's free, why not CISO?

The authors words are he doesn't want to support a compression format that nobody uses. Well if he did support it, we wouldn't see so many .daa, .uif and .isz files cropping up all over the internet forcing us to buy commercial programs just to do anything with them.

I'm not trying to make personal jabs at anybody, but Daemon tools adds support for all kinds of formats... since CISO is free, I bet it's only a matter of time before they support it too. I just want some interoperability between programs and formats and kinks form when someone won't hop on the bandwagon. That's why programs like Virtualdub don't move forward, they stagnate. It may be free, but it serves such a specific task that eventually it becomes just another program in the abyss. I would hope not to see this happen to ImgBurn.

-Neil

Edited February 16, 2009 by Neillithan

**Shamus_McFartfinger** · February 17, 2009

but Daemon tools adds support for all kinds of formats...

Daemon Tools also comes bundled with an assortment of parasitic spyware. In that sense, it's not free, is it?

Well if he did support it, we wouldn't see so many .daa, .uif and .isz files cropping up all over the internet forcing us to buy commercial programs just to do anything with them.

Uh-huh. What I suggest you do is to send an email to the makers of WinZip and WinRar and ask why they felt the need to create their own compression algorithms rather than using the accepted and free formats available before their inception such as .lha which pre-dates both of them by years. Surely, these companies didn't create their own format just to force the user to go out and buy it? Shocking.

Neillithan · February 17, 2009

but Daemon tools adds support for all kinds of formats...

Daemon Tools also comes bundled with an assortment of parasitic spyware. In that sense, it's not free, is it?

Well if he did support it, we wouldn't see so many .daa, .uif and .isz files cropping up all over the internet forcing us to buy commercial programs just to do anything with them.

Uh-huh. What I suggest you do is to send an email to the makers of WinZip and WinRar and ask why they felt the need to create their own compression algorithms rather than using the accepted and free formats available before their inception such as .lha which pre-dates both of them by years. Surely, these companies didn't create their own format just to force the user to go out and buy it? Shocking.

The problem is, .UIF, .ISZ. and .DAA are all advancements that free and open source programs have yet to conceive. Now that CISO is finally available, there's no need to use those proprietary formats to accomplish the same thing. We can use free formats.

Your logic is somewhat flawed in the sense that LHA came before ZIP and zip was somewhat of an advancement. Everybody moved to zip because it was somewhat better and of course, zip was promoted by WinZip, etc.

CISO is an advancement compared to DAA, ISZ and UIF. It uses LZMA compression while the others do not. Since it's free and open source, there's like no reason why it shouldn't be implemented into free programs.

-Neil

**LIGHTNING UK!** · February 17, 2009

Can I just jump in at say sector 2000 and decompress it? If not, that's exactly why I wouldn't implement it.

Neillithan · February 17, 2009

Can I just jump in at say sector 2000 and decompress it? If not, that's exactly why I wouldn't implement it.

You would know more about it than I would. I'm just a guy trying to promote a free and open source format. I have no idea how it works, only that it offers some benefits over regular ISO format.

There is documentation available, it might answer your question... unless your question was really just an inverted answer for why you don't want to add support for it...

-Neil

Neillithan · February 17, 2009

Can I just jump in at say sector 2000 and decompress it? If not, that's exactly why I wouldn't implement it.

I took the time to e-mail the author of Pismo and these are his words:

Yes. CISO supports random access, has to for PFM
and SMX.

There is your answer. Any chance you will review CISO for ImgBurn?

-Neil

Edited February 17, 2009 by Neillithan

**volvofl10** · February 17, 2009

A quick search reveals that this is the only thread/post about CISO on the whole of the forum.

This makes me think that with 14,000+ members,only 1 mention of it makes it seem a not very popular format at the moment.

had there been 10/20/30 results in the search, then it that may of suggested it to be a more popular format to use than normal ISO.

**mmalves** · February 17, 2009

Please mention programs that use this compression format, as I couldn't find anything

Neillithan · February 17, 2009

A quick search reveals that this is the only thread/post about CISO on the whole of the forum.

This makes me think that with 14,000+ members,only 1 mention of it makes it seem a not very popular format at the moment.

had there been 10/20/30 results in the search, then it that may of suggested it to be a more popular format to use than normal ISO.

That's because it ISN'T popular. It's completely new and I'm probably one in 10 people that have discovered it on the net by accident.

Please mention programs that use this compression format, as I couldn't find anything

As of right now, Pismo File Mount is the only one that I know of. Thing is, it's a compressed ISO... but there is some interoperability. You can expose the ISO inside by typing a line in the address bar of explorer. With the exposed iso, you can burn it to DVD and any program that can use ISO can use the exposed ISO. I found this out by contacting the author of Pismo because I was curious if there was a way to burn CISO files... Until more people start adding support for CISO, this will be the only way to do it. But compare to other formats like ISZ, DAA and UIF... they don't let you do that because they simply DON'T do things that way. Just one more reason why CISO is cooler.

It's just a pain in the butt to do that and it doesn't always work. Example: I tried to mount an exposed ISO from a CISO file with daemon tools. Daemon gave me an error.

Thing is, sure... nobody uses CISO right now... but that's no reason not to support it. Every program and format starts off that way... how do you think they gain large scale support later? They must be promoted first.

-Neil

Edited February 17, 2009 by Neillithan

**Shamus_McFartfinger** · February 18, 2009

The problem is, .UIF, .ISZ. and .DAA are all advancements that free and open source programs have yet to conceive. Now that CISO is finally available, there's no need to use those proprietary formats to accomplish the same thing. We can use free formats.

The question is, are these formats really required and who the hell is going to use it? The only place I've seen .cso files is ripped Sony PSP images and they can't be burned as blank UMD media isn't available to the public.

Your logic is somewhat flawed in the sense that LHA came before ZIP and zip was somewhat of an advancement. Everybody moved to zip because it was somewhat better and of course, zip was promoted by WinZip, etc.

Your logic is somewhat flawed as ZIP didn't deliver better compression. The ancestor of WinZip was PKZip which was available in both the Amiga and Windows/DOS formats as an alternative to LHArc/LHA and LZX. ZIP was pushed as the archiver of choice for Windows. Just because it became popular, doesn't make it better. Windows itself is an example of that.... but I digress...

CISO is an advancement compared to DAA, ISZ and UIF. It uses LZMA compression while the others do not. Since it's free and open source, there's like no reason why it shouldn't be implemented into free programs.

Possibly. You might be right. It might be better. The reason I'm being such an arsehole is twofold. Firstly, the adoption rate of this format is paltry as best. If Lightning_UK decides to implement it, what then? How many people will use it? 1 in a thousand? 1 in ten thousand? It seems alot of work for the author to implement this thing when virtually nobody will use it. Secondly, the expectation here is for you to convince the author that it's a good idea. Provide evidence that the hard work that HE has to do is going to be worthwhile. ImgBurn is Lightning_Uk's baby. At the end of the day, he'll do what he wants to do. We're here to help those with problems - and by being argumentative, we filter out most of the crap.

**spinningwheel** · February 18, 2009

and by being argumentative, we filter out most of the crap.

Never been called a crap filter before..... =)) =)) =))

**volvofl10** · February 18, 2009

Spinner ........... your a crap filter

LOL, thats twice in 1 day now =)) now youll have to go back and edit your post about "not being called a crap filter before" :whistling:

**spinningwheel** · February 18, 2009

LOL, thats twice in 1 day now now youll have to go back and edit your post about "not being called a crap filter before"

Too damned funny... =)) =)) =))

**volvofl10** · February 18, 2009

someone on here did once say that i was "full of crap" . if i had known i was a filter at the time i would'nt of felt so bad about that statement :whistling:

Neillithan · February 18, 2009

The question is, are these formats really required and who the hell is going to use it? The only place I've seen .cso files is ripped Sony PSP images and they can't be burned as blank UMD media isn't available to the public.

I'm not sure .CSO and .CISO are the same thing. I could be wrong, but after doing a google search a few days ago, I pretty much just assumed .CSO was a file belonging to Sony, therefore it had to be a completely different format.

Your logic is somewhat flawed as ZIP didn't deliver better compression. The ancestor of WinZip was PKZip which was available in both the Amiga and Windows/DOS formats as an alternative to LHArc/LHA and LZX. ZIP was pushed as the archiver of choice for Windows. Just because it became popular, doesn't make it better. Windows itself is an example of that.... but I digress...

My knowledge of such formats (Zip, Rar, 7z) are only recent. I have no experience with any of those formats during the Amiga days, even though I did use Amiga in the past.. I was too young to be a power user, I just used it for playing games. However, I'm not scared to admit that I shouldn't have even dabbled with this subject, my own ignorance makes me look foolish. Still, I feel compelled to defend against elitists who think they know EVERYTHING when I never intended for this thread to be received the way it was. Some of you guys have stark views on things, I'll leave at that.

Possibly. You might be right. It might be better. The reason I'm being such an arsehole is twofold. Firstly, the adoption rate of this format is paltry as best. If Lightning_UK decides to implement it, what then? How many people will use it? 1 in a thousand? 1 in ten thousand? It seems alot of work for the author to implement this thing when virtually nobody will use it. Secondly, the expectation here is for you to convince the author that it's a good idea. Provide evidence that the hard work that HE has to do is going to be worthwhile. ImgBurn is Lightning_Uk's baby. At the end of the day, he'll do what he wants to do. We're here to help those with problems - and by being argumentative, we filter out most of the crap.

You have an interesting choice of words, but in the end I must point out that I came here with 1 thing in mind and that was promote an open source and free format. If I could e-mail the author directly with a simple introduction of CISO, I could have avoided all of this confrontation. I have nothing against it, I just prefer to avoid it. Maybe I could have found his e-mail somewhere, I didn't really check. I just assumed this was the more appropriate place to go anyway and I've learned something as a result. He doesn't even WANT to be bothered by people. It's in his sig.

To be completely honest, I don't mind what others think, whether it's people that use ImgBurn or diehards that live at its forum. You people are pests. I am awaiting Lightning UK's verdict and I have a pretty good idea it will be a big flat out "no". To be more honest, I'd much rather prefer a short reason why he wouldn't support it, but I also have a good idea what that will be as well. I've already answered his question regarding random access, the least he could do is supply a courtesy-response. I'm not here to convince. Maybe that's what it has looked like so far, but I'll remind you that you got the wrong impression.

People are always adding support for things that don't have high adoption rates. Take a look at Linux. If it's free and open source, eventually Linux will have it. I'm not saying that's a great thing, I'm just saying that's an interesting thing.

In the end, I don't really care if he decides to support CISO. Seeing as this is a one man project (I'm assuming), I can't expect him to be enthusiastic about the idea of it anyway. That's all.

-Neil

P.S. Go ahead, rip me to shreds. It's what you're here for.

Edited February 18, 2009 by Neillithan

**volvofl10** · February 19, 2009

You people are pests.

Oh dear, how to upset all the beta team in 1 go .

Personally, the way youve been harping on about this thing makes me think its spam, but i held back to see what developed.

I thought at one point you was the author of the program you was on about thinking you was looking for free adverts , thats how it come's across

P.S. Go ahead, rip me to shreds. It's what you're here for.

why bother ? without saying a word , you'll keep giving us more ammo anyway :rolleyes:

EDIT

couldnt be arsed to hit the 'submit' button in the end

**spinningwheel** · February 19, 2009

P.S. Go ahead, rip me to shreds. It's what you're here for.

No it's not! We really are here to assist with ImgBurn problems, make suggestions to try to assist users and run Beta tests on the in-process improvements of the program. We also lean back, have a beer or coffee and look at other posts and try to assist with the problems/suggestions/notions that a lot of our posters propose without taking ourselves, or the users, too seriously and while having a little fun with each other and with the users. You happened to make a suggestion that prompted a lot of response, and, as you grew more intense in your insistence and posting prose, we began to have more and more fun with you. There is nothing sacred or secret about the program, it is LUK's baby, it's not available for open source, and we are the ones he trusts with the caring and nurturing of his brain-child. LUK's response, in the case of most users, would have let them know that he's not interested, at this time, in the suggestion. You missed that and continued on with your reasoning and that opened the door to the length of this thread and several of the responses you received in response to your responses. So sit back, have a beer or whatever refreshment appeals to you, and watch and wait for the next 'fly' to enter the web...I do, and it's entertaining while you learn about this great program and its' awesome capabilities.

spinner

Neillithan · February 19, 2009

I thought at one point you was the author of the program you was on about thinking you was looking for free advertism , thats how it came across

You know what they say, most people don't read more than the first 4 posts. You're the exception, you skip them!

No it's not! We really are here to assist with ImgBurn problems, make suggestions to try to assist users and run Beta tests on the in-process improvements of the program. We also lean back, have a beer or coffee and look at other posts and try to assist with the problems/suggestions/notions that a lot of our posters propose without taking ourselves, or the users, too seriously and while having a little fun with each other and with the users. You happened to make a suggestion that prompted a lot of response, and, as you grew more intense in your insistence and posting prose, we began to have more and more fun with you. There is nothing sacred or secret about the program, it is LUK's baby, it's not available for open source, and we are the ones he trusts with the caring and nurturing of his brain-child. LUK's response, in the case of most users, would have let them know that he's not interested, at this time, in the suggestion. You missed that and continued on with your reasoning and that opened the door to the length of this thread and several of the responses you received in response to your responses. So sit back, have a beer or whatever refreshment appeals to you, and watch and wait for the next 'fly' to enter the web...I do, and it's entertaining while you learn about this great program and its' awesome capabilities.

spinner

Well I'm glad you have such a positive spin on all of this. I'm almost ready to bury this one, but I take it from your response that's probably what I should do. BTW, I'm not a fool. I figured Lightning UK's response was really his way of saying "No"... but I still felt inclined to rebound.

-Neil

Edited February 19, 2009 by Neillithan

**LOCOENG** · February 19, 2009

/me thinks volvo's spell checker is broken again.

**spinningwheel** · February 19, 2009

that's probably what I should do

:thumbup:

**spinningwheel** · February 19, 2009

me thinks volvo's spell checker is broken again.

When was it fixed? :blink:

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