Problem Doing Full Capacity Format (WAS: ImgBurn Formatted BD50-RE into a BD25-RE)

[rgrele]

Using a LG GGW-H20L drive with a BD50-RE Sony disc. Had 3 successful burns using ImgBurn 2.4.2.0

 

Yesterday, upgraded to 2.4.3.0 and decided to do a full format before burning and encountered a glitch (see log):

 

; //****************************************\\

; ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 - Log

; Wednesday, 08 April 2009, 05:10:45

; \\****************************************//

;

;

I 22:33:09 ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 started!

I 22:33:09 Microsoft Windows XP Media Center Edition (5.1, Build 2600 : Service Pack 3)

I 22:33:09 Total Physical Memory: 2,096,492 KB - Available: 1,616,336 KB

I 22:33:09 Initialising SPTI...

I 22:33:09 Searching for SCSI / ATAPI devices...

I 22:33:11 Found 1 DVD-ROM, 1 DVD

Edited April 9, 2009 by rgrele

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Please post all the disc info (from the box on the right) when you're in Write mode with that disc in the drive.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

No problem here.

 

Log:

 

I 13:21:20 ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.3 Beta started!

I 13:21:20 Microsoft Windows Vista Ultimate Edition (6.0, Build 6001 : Service Pack 1)

I 13:21:20 Total Physical Memory: 3,405,392 KB - Available: 1,049,772 KB

I 13:21:20 Initialising SPTI...

I 13:21:20 Searching for SCSI / ATAPI devices...

I 13:21:36 Found 1 DVD

[rgrele]

Please post all the disc info (from the box on the right) when you're in Write mode with that disc in the drive.

 

HL-DT-ST BD-RE GGW-H20L YL05 (ATA)

Current Profile: BD-RE

 

Disc Information:

Status: Complete

Erasable: Yes

Sessions: 1

Sectors: 23,652,352

Size: 48,440,016,896 bytes

Time: 5256:06:52 (MM:SS:FF)

 

TOC Information:

Session 1... (LBA: 0)

-> Track 01 (Mode 1, LBA: 0 - 23652351)

-> LeadOut (LBA: 23652352)

 

BD Disc Information:

Disc ID: MEI-T01-01

Disc Type: BD-RE

 

Format Capacities:

DT: 0x02 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x00 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23259136 (0x0162E800) - TDP: 36864

FT: 0x30 - NB: 24307712 (0x0172E800) - TDP: 4096

FT: 0x31 - NB: 24438784 (0x0174E800) - TDP: 2048

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Size: 48,440,016,896 bytes

 

It certainly looks like ~50gb to me!

[rgrele]

Size: 48,440,016,896 bytes

 

It certainly looks like ~50gb to me!

 

I tried burning again last night. Received a message to the effect that maximum capacity of disc was a BD25 and did I wish to continue anyway. I selected yes, and let the burn proceed.

 

This morning I checked the status, and it failed (stopped at BD25 capacity.)

 

Here is the log for that burn:

 

; //****************************************\\

; ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 - Log

; Wednesday, 08 April 2009, 12:20:30

; \\****************************************//

;

;

I 05:13:08 ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 started!

I 05:13:08 Microsoft Windows XP Media Center Edition (5.1, Build 2600 : Service Pack 3)

I 05:13:08 Total Physical Memory: 1,047,916 KB - Available: 639,264 KB

I 05:13:08 Initialising SPTI...

I 05:13:08 Searching for SCSI / ATAPI devices...

I 05:13:08 Found 1 DVD-ROM, 1 DVD

[mmalves]

W 05:18:26 User accepted disc space warning and is attempting to overburn!

I 05:18:26 Source File Sectors: 24,272,032 (MODE1/2048)

I 05:18:26 Destination Media Sectors: 23,652,352

W 08:51:19 Failed to Write Sectors 23652352 - 23652383 - Reason: Logical Block Address out of Range

You've tried to overburn and it failed, but that's not BD25 capacity, that's BD50. In Tools -> Settings -> Write tab, is the option 'Prefer Format Without Spare Areas' checked or unchecked?

[rgrele]

W 05:18:26 User accepted disc space warning and is attempting to overburn!

I 05:18:26 Source File Sectors: 24,272,032 (MODE1/2048)

I 05:18:26 Destination Media Sectors: 23,652,352

W 08:51:19 Failed to Write Sectors 23652352 - 23652383 - Reason: Logical Block Address out of Range

You've tried to overburn and it failed, but that's not BD25 capacity, that's BD50. In Tools -> Settings -> Write tab, is the option 'Prefer Format Without Spare Areas' checked or unchecked?

 

'Prefer Format Without Spare Areas' is checked (by default it seems.)

 

I noticed on the previous version (using the default settings) that it is not checked. But on the latest version it is. I have always burned this BD50-RE using the default settings.

 

The problem seems to have begun when I tried to do the full erase and got the first warning: "Potential 'WaitImmediateIO' Deferred Error - (99%, 0/4) - Format Command Failed."

 

It is strange that the box on the right still reports that the disc is a BD50.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

If that 'prefer format without spare areas' option was enabled when you did the full format, for some reason your drive has failed to format the disc without spare areas and that's why you're ending up WITH them.

 

When they're there, some of the disc's capacity is lost (so the drive can automatically reassign bad sectors etc)... but certainly not anywhere near enough to take it back to BD25 size.

 

This is the max sector count: 24,438,784

This is the number you've got available: 23,652,352

 

So that's a difference of 786,432 sectors

 

= 1,610,612,736 Bytes

= 1,572,864 KB

= 1,536 MB

= 1.5 GB

[rgrele]

Just tried to do a "Quick Erase" on the same BD50-RE disc and got the "blue screen of death" (system crashed.)

 

Upon reboot, and checking the ImgBurn information box on the right, it now says this:

 

HL-DT-ST BD-RE GGW-H20L YL05 (ATA)

Current Profile: BD-RE

 

Disc Information:

Status: Complete

Erasable: Yes

 

TOC Information:

Session 1... (LBA: 0)

-> Track 01 (Mode 1, LBA: 0 - 23652351)

-> LeadOut (LBA: 23652352)

 

BD Disc Information:

Disc ID: MEI-T01-01

Disc Type: BD-RE

 

Format Capacities:

DT: 0x02 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x00 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23259136 (0x0162E800) - TDP: 36864

FT: 0x30 - NB: 24307712 (0x0172E800) - TDP: 4096

FT: 0x31 - NB: 24438784 (0x0174E800) - TDP: 2048

 

I have just started a FULL ERASE with the box 'prefer format without spare areas' option UNCHECKED this time. I did this in the hope that it would at least bring the disc back to it's previous BD50 capacity.

 

It is currently at 2%.

 

I'll report back when/if it finishes formatting.

Edited April 8, 2009 by rgrele

[LIGHTNING UK!]

It won't.

 

It must be checked to get the full capacity - that's why it now defaults to being checked.

[rgrele]

It won't.

 

It must be checked to get the full capacity - that's why it now defaults to being checked.

 

What I meant was that I was hoping that by unchecking the box, I'd at least get the "old" format capacity back (48,440,016,896 the way it was when it was new.) I know that was under actual format capacity yours shows, but at least it worked.

 

If this fails, I'll try one more time (FULL ERASE with the 'prefer format without spare areas' box checked) and see if it finally fixes the glitch.

 

If you can think of anything else that I might try to get this Sony BD50-RE disc formatted correctly, I'd appreciate it.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Sorry, I don't get your point?

 

The disc is already formatted to 48,440,016,896 bytes - that's what 23652352 sectors is.

 

There's no reason to do it again if you're happy with that size.

[rgrele]

Sorry, I don't get your point?

 

The disc is already formatted to 48,440,016,896 bytes - that's what 23652352 sectors is.

 

There's no reason to do it again if you're happy with that size.

 

I'm sorry. I was confused about the sectors vs. bytes information. You are correct. The BD50-RE has always shown that it had 48,440,016,896 bytes (23652352 sectors.)

 

My problem with this drive seems to be trying to get the disc to format the larger (full 50GB) size.

 

The full erase of the Sony BD50-RE disc was successful with the 'prefer format without spare areas' UNCHECKED. I have now started another full erase cycle with the box checked. I need to find out if I can obtain the extra space for a burn larger than the 48,440,016,896 bytes available. Yours seems to have no difficulty formatting for the full 50GB.

 

I should also tell you that I have TWO LG GGW-H20L drives. The one in my upstairs PC seems to be the one that is giving me problems after I installed ImgBurn ver. 2.4.3.0

 

In fact, I just ran a FULL ERASE on a Memorex BD25-RE and encountered the same warning message that I received before with the BD50-RE (This is with the 'prefer format without spare areas' checked. Please note the warning message (in bold text):

 

; //****************************************\\

; ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 - Log

; Wednesday, 08 April 2009, 17:43:56

; \\****************************************//

;

;

I 14:15:14 ImgBurn Version 2.4.3.0 started!

I 14:15:14 Microsoft Windows XP Media Center Edition (5.1, Build 2600 : Service Pack 3)

I 14:15:14 Total Physical Memory: 2,096,492 KB - Available: 1,670,972 KB

I 14:15:14 Initialising SPTI...

I 14:15:14 Searching for SCSI / ATAPI devices...

I 14:15:16 Found 1 DVD-ROM, 1 DVD

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Reverting won't do anything, the command is the same no matter which program (or version of it) sends it.

 

Are the 'MEI-T01-01' dye discs brand new? Are they branded by Panasonic or another make?

[rgrele]

Reverting won't do anything, the command is the same no matter which program (or version of it) sends it.

 

Are the 'MEI-T01-01' dye discs brand new? Are they branded by Panasonic or another make?

 

They are BD50-RE Sony branded discs. Bought 2 of them, brand new, from Amazon.com about a week ago. Have already done at least 3 successful burns/re-writes on each, using the previous version of ImgBurn 2.4.2.0

 

While I was using them with ImgBurn 2.4.2.0, I did not know that it was possible to format them to a larger capacity. So I made do with what I had, and never encountered a glitch of any kind.

 

I have only experienced problems after I started using ImgBurn 2.4.3.0 and tried to increase the formatted size. And (so far) only on the upstairs drive.

 

By the way, would you happen to know what this error message (W 15:39:04 Potential 'WaitImmediateIO' Deferred Error - (99%, 0/4) - Format Command Failed) means? Is it perhaps a defect in my drive?

[LIGHTNING UK!]

The last bit of the error line is what the drive reported whilst ImgBurn was polling it (which happens every second) to see if it had finished doing its part of the Erase yet.

 

i.e. ImgBurn asked 'Are you done yet?' and it replied 'Format Command Failed'. This reply came back when when the drive was supposedly '99%' of the way through the erase process.

 

It doesn't tell me WHY it failed, just that it did... so really you know as much as I do!

 

My MEI-T01-01 discs are branded/sold by Panasonic. There's always a chance the Panasonic ones are slightly better quality / made somewhere different to the Sony ones.

 

If one of your drives can complete the exact same erase operation in 2.4.3.0 that the other drive failed on (and you try it on one after the other, a couple of times over), yeah I'd say that drive is faulty (or needs cleaning).

 

You already know that my drive has no problem formatting that dye to its full capacity.

[rgrele]

Very well. I shall press on and see what happens.

 

I thank you for all your extremely prompt and helpful support. STELLAR! Absolutely STELLAR!!!

 

BTW, I have made a small contribution to your organization just now via PayPal.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

No organisation, it's just me

 

Thank you

[Falcon]

I'm kinda curious about something that hadn't been mentioned here that would put the pieces together... I don't mean to butt in or be an annoyance, but I wanted to mention what seems obvious to me...

 

What if sending the "don't use spare areas" function forces the drive into an error when it encounters an unreadable area that it would otherwise have marked to the spare area? And if that "don't use spare areas" box is unchecked, the resulting capacity is just slightly less than the point which ImgBurn considers a disc a BD50, so it falls back to "calling it" a BD25? What are the parameters that make ImgBurn "recognize" the different discs anyway?

 

IMHO it'd always be a better idea to let the drive reserve a spare area, just for how sensitive the discs are, and how useful the "bad sector detection" is on DVD+RW's (in my experience - I've never had a DVD+RW go bad thanks to the adaptive bad-sector marking). Why would you ever need to save a few bytes to sacrifice an incredibly useful disc feature...?

[LIGHTNING UK!]

The whole BD25 / BD50 issue was never an issue in the first place - it doesn't exist (this was covered in earlier posts).

 

The OP was reading the 'Sectors' count - which is 23,xxx,xxx and thought the '23' part sounded a little BD25ish.

 

I agree, spare areas are useful - except for when having them on prevents you from being able to burn an image that's designed for a disc without them - as is the case here.

 

Technically, in this specific situation it would in fact be possible to leave spare areas enabled but ImgBurn would need to format allowing for the minimum amount, not the maximum.

 

I 05:18:26 Source File Sectors: 24,272,032 (MODE1/2048)

 

FT: 0x00 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23652352 (0x0168E800) - TDP: 24576

FT: 0x30 - NB: 23259136 (0x0162E800) - TDP: 36864

FT: 0x30 - NB: 24307712 (0x0172E800) - TDP: 4096

FT: 0x31 - NB: 24438784 (0x0174E800) - TDP: 2048

 

NB = Number of blocks - i.e. Sectors.

 

I will add an option to allow you to select the preferred amount (i.e. the first one in the list for a given format type - the 'with spare areas' one is 0x30 - giving you 23652352 sectors), the minimum amount (giving you 24307712 sectors) or the maximum amount (giving you 23259136 sectors).

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Ok, all done

 

You have a lot more options now when it comes to deciding on how to format your BD-RE

 

Have a play around with 2.4.4.0 when it comes out and see if can get it working with spare areas turned on and the format size set to maximum.

 

If you disable full certification and properly formatted discs it'll only take about 30 seconds too - but you should only disable certification if you know the disc is 100% fine (or don't care if it's not).

 

The 'prefer properly formatted discs' option will make ImgBurn zero fill all the sectors on the disc once the drive says it's finished doing its part (i.e. preparing the disc for the new formatted size and certifying it).

[rgrele]

Ok, all done

 

You have a lot more options now when it comes to deciding on how to format your BD-RE

 

Have a play around with 2.4.4.0 when it comes out and see if can get it working with spare areas turned on and the format size set to maximum.

 

If you disable full certification and properly formatted discs it'll only take about 30 seconds too - but you should only disable certification if you know the disc is 100% fine (or don't care if it's not).

 

The 'prefer properly formatted discs' option will make ImgBurn zero fill all the sectors on the disc once the drive says it's finished doing its part (i.e. preparing the disc for the new formatted size and certifying it).

 

I may have found a solution to my original problem.

 

First, let me say that I was in error when I first reported that ImgBurn had formatted my BD50-RE into a BD25-RE. This is NOT what actually happened, and was not the programs fault at all. What I was trying to do was increase the capacity of a BD50-RE (and BD25-RE) to the maximum possible data capacity.

 

When I first attempted this, I was using the recently released ImgBurn ver. 2.4.3.0 (which no longer displays the "preferred format capacity" et al, in the status box on the right. Not having this as a reference, I erroneously mistook the "sectors available"" information for the "bytes available" information, and thought that ImgBurn had decreased the capacity of my disc.

 

I have since discovered that my LG BluRay burner was the culprit. For some reason, when I selected a full capacity erase function, it was giving me an error when it reached 99% of the operation. I had to manually stop the process, and the disc was then only reporting that it had the lower capacity.

 

The reason that I'm assuming that the burner is at fault is because I have 2 identical units. One will perform the full format operation without a glitch, while the other stops at 99%. Both are using the same version of ImgBurn with the exact same settings.

 

The error message I was experiencing was: "W 15:39:04 Potential 'WaitImmediateIO' Deferred Error - (99%, 0/4) - Format Command Failed." Last night I Googled this information and found that someone suggested I change one particular setting in ImgBurn. Under Settings: / I/O Settings: / Don't Use Immediate I/O check the box "Enable".

 

After doing this, I was able to complete the full capacity erase format and burn on a BD25-RE without getting the error message. I have not tried it with a BD50-RE as yet, but will within the next day or so. And will report results.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

Make sure you tick that box again, it's there for debugging purposes really and the erase command is not the only one to make use of it.

 

Not using immediate I/O means it'll hog the bus and no status (i.e. % complete) can be provided.

 

Also note that unless 4 different attempts to format the disc fail, the 'erase' process in ImgBurn wouldn't display an error when that Immediate I/O setting is disabled. When enabled, you at least know there was a problem somewhere along the line even if a later command succeeds.

 

I've changed how 2.4.4.0 does things so that if it fails, you'll know about it - and without any special hidden retries on the program's part.

[rgrele]

Make sure you tick that box again, it's there for debugging purposes really and the erase command is not the only one to make use of it.

 

Not using immediate I/O means it'll hog the bus and no status (i.e. % complete) can be provided.

 

Also note that unless 4 different attempts to format the disc fail, the 'erase' process in ImgBurn wouldn't display an error when that Immediate I/O setting is disabled. When enabled, you at least know there was a problem somewhere along the line even if a later command succeeds.

 

I've changed how 2.4.4.0 does things so that if it fails, you'll know about it - and without any special hidden retries on the program's part.

 

Yes. The proof of the pudding will be when I watch the disc from start to finish without any burps. If it passes that test, only then will I know if the format/burn was truly error free.

 

Just thought of another way to check the disc. I'll rip it to a hard drive image on my other PC/burner and see if that turns out O.K. If there are any disc read errors during the rip, I'll know that the "fix" isn't reliable.

Edited April 9, 2009 by rgrele